concerning the 102 families

[Suzanne]

I understand when AIT started they started out with a testing of 102 orginal families.  All of the families homeschooled etc.  I have heard from one of the 102 on this forum and wonder if any others on this board are of the 102 orginal or know of any families who were of the orginal.  I ask as I wonder if any of those families turned out to have children grow up nutured in the things of the Lord and as a result they are raising their own children the same way.

I do think that you could raise your kids with the ATI principles without damaging them if the parents were loving and balanced in their decision making.  I think a lot would have to deal with the amount of love the parents mixed in with the disciplined and if they were sensitive to their children's needs.  

Do any of you know if the second generation of ATI famlies are following their parents example and are raising their kids likewise in the same manner?

I know the Duggar family bought 20 acres of land and built a beatiful home and the father mentioned that he hopes each of his 16 kids will wish to build their homes on the same property.  That is his dream to have all his kids there and his grandchildren.  sounds like a great dream and I pray they all grow up to be nutured in the Lord and will pass down to the next generation balanced Christians.

[Anonymous]

there are very few second generation families, largely in part because of the narrowness of the lifestyle and the lack of opportunities that present themselves to children who are encouraged not to go to college, not to interact with those unlike them and find it difficult to live outside of the contrived "bubble" constructed by their parents.  these parents do not rear children to live and function in society--- any society other than their own.  it is hard for me to read your comments, personally, because i feel like you have viewed a program about a few days [a window, if you will] in the life of a reality show family and you seem to be willing to re-imagine your own hopes and dreams, and the future of your child based on this window.  

this is why ati was such an easy sell to people like my parents who came out of the '60's and '70's hoping that christianity and gothard's "new way of life" would save them and their children from the societal and personal ills of that era.  they largely withdrew from outside influence except for gothard and their church---some families even nixed that and did "home church"--and began a journey through what has resulted in much confusion for their children, children who tend to be Bible-wise and somewhat intelligent on a level, but find it difficult to engage in a well-rounded life on their own without questioning everything they were taught to believe.  gothard teaches that a human being is wrong for wanting autonomy and rebellious for making any decisions that do not mirror the wishes and opinions of authority.   when you are taught that you are rebellious and "bad" for acting on your own in any way, how easy do you think it is for me, as an adult, to make the choices i need to make to succeed on my own when i feel like my parents (and God) hate me for even the slightest wavering from their "principles"?  higher education, marriage, career, childrearing,  spirituality.... it all becomes terribly complicated and not very joyful at all.  

my parents broke away from ati and the gothard seminar after 16 years, and i'm fortunate that my family is still largely intact.  i guess my parents decided that their "happy family"--- the one you seem to be idolizing, quite frankly---would have to come at the cost of having their adult children walk away from them eventaully from the pressure of "not measuring up".  all 4 of us have had our struggles, because our parents were unable or unwilling to provide direction or insight into life that didn't fit in with the gothard ideal--- girls get married early and have children, boys "apprentice" with some tradesman, no one goes to college, live under tha patriarchal leadershp and "wisdom" of the father even into adulthood...blah blah blah.  i'm proud to say that my parents did not fully buy into the "showcase family" (yes, there is an ati term for families like the duggars.)  all four of us have attended college, have scholarships, and have learned how to maintian good relationships with the opposite sex after years of wondering, "hmmmm...is it all right for me to go on a date."  the bounderies between adult children and their parents are tough enough in a healthy family sometimes.  imagine being reared to believe that those lines don't go into effect until you get yourself married off!  

of course families like the duggars appear to be happy right now.  the children are young and have never faced any bumps in the raod that have caused conflict with the parents' ideals.  when that happens, the children will either buck up and take a balanced view of life and their responsibility for themselves, or they will crash when they find that all the female submission and hair and soft voices, and all the peculiarities that make them feel both weird yet oddly secure will not make them relevant in a world that is aching for people to stand up and deliver something relevant and profitable. all i can say is, they'd better find a tradesman who can help them make enough money to build houses on daddy's land, because it's the only place where they will belong.

if you want an elysian dream, take your daughter to a museum and enjoy some vangogh.  let her know that she is valuable as an individual with her own tastes and apptitudes.  let her know that God is a God of cans, not cannots, and that whatever path she chooses in life, she has your love.  guide her, help her make good friends, learn amazing things and make sure she gets the best education you or anyone else can offer, and encourage her to get scholarships and begin to show initiative for her own success early in life.  give her time to grow into a strong, knowledgeable, and positive woman, whether or not her voice is always soft or if you two share in raucous laughter over a joke or watching a movie.  there are millions of happy mothers and daughters out there---grown ups--- who are close because they get through the tough times together, make mistakes and learn from them together.  i never knew this was possible until i became a grown up myself and learned that my mother was human. why didn't i know that?  i don't know....maybe becaus she was told it was better to have an ideal and stick to it that to be real with me.

[Suzanne]

"teaches that a human being is wrong for wanting autonomy and rebellious for making any decisions that do not mirror the wishes and opinions of authority. when you are taught that you are rebellious and "bad" for acting on your own in any way, how easy do you think it is for me, as an adult, to make the choices i need to make to succeed on my own when i feel like my parents (and God) hate me for even the slightest wavering from their "principles"? higher education, marriage, career, childrearing, spirituality.... it all becomes terribly complicated and not very joyful at all. "

After I read the above I can see why being in a family that uses ATI can be harmful, as if one deviated from any of their principles you would be on such a guilt trip and therefore lack "joy" in your life.  That is sad.  I know the one time experience I had with the pastor/priniciple of a school I taught at when I was still single put a lot of guilt trips on me.  He made my life miserable, but then I thought he had controll issues.  Seeing the Duggar family ass so happy made me rethink that such training can be positive if the parents were not so controlling.  Just a thought.  Thanks for sharing.

[Been There]

I am a child of one of the first 102 families, and I can tell you - it was HORRIBLE!  I would never put my children through that hell.

[Suzanne]

Posted: Mon Apr 03 2006, 06:09AM
I am a child of one of the first 102 families, and I can tell you - it was HORRIBLE! I would never put my children through that hell.

Do you think you had a father with controll issues? Had he not been part of  ATI do you think he would have been so controlling?  

[Been There]

Who knows?  Who can tell?  I could sit and analyze for hours what my family went through, but at the end of it all, the result is still the same.

[spaceriver]

We applied to be one of the 102 families and were turned down.  I thank the Lord for His Mercies. (we didn't have the $50 if I remember correctly)

[smugsmilz]

My husbands family is one of the pilot families. (I was also in ATI growing up but not in a pilot family)

There are 6 kids in his family. None are second generation ATI-ers and barely any of them voluntarily speak to their parents.

I can appreciate your curiousity in learning about this sect of Christianity and at the risk of 'driving you right into their arms' my advice is learn from what you read here and then run like heck in the opposite direction of Gothardism.

What little good is in the programs is far outweighed by the heartache that inevitably follows.

I must also reply to your raising your kids in ATI principles-I dont intend to raise my kids by ATI prinicples but by the original handbook-the Bible. Unfortunately ATI and the Good Book dont always go hand in hand.

As for the Duggars-their family is still young. Lets check back in 20 years and see where all the children are. Time is the ultimate barometer in lifes journey.

I strongly suspect that the Duggar children autobiographies will be right up there next to Blanket Jacksons 'tell-all'.

[VeganHunter]

Oh, goodness.  One thing I can't ever blame ATI for is worsening my father's control issues - if anything, his control issues made it hard for him to stay in the program.  

Was there really a $50 application fee?  Surprised my parents applied ... though they probably got someone to spot them.  Hmm.  Money was the reason we eventually left.  They'd promised at the beginning that the original 102 wouldn't have to pay registration fees ... but at some point they did, and it became too much.

One of my sisters is home-schooling her kids.  Not sure whether she's using anything gothardesque, but she's quite the Stepford robot, so I'm sure she'll give them all the benefits of the "basic principles."

At times, I've fished around for old pilot contacts, hoping to find someone else who smartened up and left.  But they all seem pretty happy.  Good for them, I guess.

[Eliyahu Jones]

I know that this is going on twwo years old, but did anybody notice how the original author mentioned children being "nutured" for the lord?  There's two way to go with that, and I'm going for the one that's funny.  After all, even Jesus said that some were born to be eunics... :^P'