The Gothard Dictionary of Spiritual terms and jargon

[encourager]

Gothard tends to twist terminology in the Bible and has his own definitions of words and phrases. This is what causes the most damage and makes the God of grace who wants to be our friend and savior out to be our task master and prison keeper.

Some of the words and phrases that he may have different defintions for are: grace, sanctification, justification, walking in the Spirit, dying to self, humility, and redemption.

These are just a few of the words, phrases and concepts that he may have different definitions for. If these essential truths are distorted we get a totally warped view of the gospel and our salvation is nullified and reduced to practically nothing. We then run on system of merit and works.

This thread is to expose and clearify some of lies and false definitions that cause many of us that have been influenced by Gothard's teachings to get a wrong view of God.

Grace: What does it mean? Is it unmerited favor? Is it the power to try harder to keep the law? Is it a ticket to heaven, but somehow we need to struggle and strive to somehow try to free ourselves from the evils of this world? Is it a license to keep on sinning and still get to heaven? What is it?

Walking in the Spirit: What is it? Is it trying hard to keep the law? Trusting in God's supernatural presence to live a transformed life? Is it mystical? Is it fantasy? Is it a frame of mind? Is it just positive thinking?

Justification: Is it JUST AS IF WE NEVER SINNED? Is it total pardon of sin: past, present and future? Is it only our past sins that are covered? Does it mean we are pleasing to God on the sole basis of the shed blood of Christ, or do we need to do something else? Does it mean we are postionally pardoned, but in reality we are still slaves to sin?

Sanctification: Does it mean we have to totally seperate ourselves from the world to be righteous? Is it a requirement for all who profess to know Christ? Is it a process or miracle from heaven or both? Is it something we do or something God does or both? Does it come automatically when we get saved or is it something that is continually worked out in our daily lives?

Dying to self: Is this total self abasement? Is this totally giving up the pleasures of this world? Is it just a position we have in Christ? Is it something that has already been accomplished when Jesus died on the cross or is this something that we have to struggle and strive to do in our daily lives?

Humility: What is it? Is it the state of being totally passive and submissive to the point where you become a door mat for everyone to walk on? Is it abondoning your free will and rights? Is simple trust in God? Is it relying upon God's power and strength and giving Him the glory for all things? Is it just not boasting in yourself? Is it total selflessness?

Redemption: What is it? Is being bought by the blood of Christ from the dominion of darkness? Does it mean Christ now has ownership of us so we don't have freedom? Does it mean we are free or are we still slaves? Are we slaves of Christ? Is it burdensome?

How one defines these terms greatly effects their relationship with God and how they view life. It is the difference between bondage and liberty, life and death, peace and restlessness, joy and dispair.

There may be many more terms I have not mentioned. This thread is to discuss these terms. It may include terms like: faith, obedience, loyalty, wisdom, the fear of God. Many of these terms have Gothardized definitions that puts his own slant on the Bible. Things that mess up the brain and frustrate the soul. Any term or concept that is used can be discussed on this thread.

[daveixoye]

there is no human being on the planet with whom I agree.  But I have trouble understanding why anyone would feel deceived by this humble man.  I first took IBLP in 1973 and have continued to review the seminar as I have matured.
Collecting degrees in psychology and philosophy (analytic reasoning trac) at University of California at Santa Barbara, I have a fair amount of practice at discerning rationale.  I have kept a running analysis of both Gothard and IBLP.  I met a man who grew up in the youth ministry of Gothard during the 1950's who is still good friends with Bill and he introduced me to Bill in 1991.
I have nothing buy admiration for Mr. Gothard.  His concepts are sound and reliable.  While I understand that we all disagree on a myriad of points, I can't help but wonder why so many have misunderstood or taken such an illogical view of his presentations.  I know that some have fallen into the trap of legalism due to a failure to properly process the information given, but this is simply due to taking the word of Gothard as the Word of God.  Bill is teaching sound APPLICATION but rarely discusses doctrine or theology.  Most of these are assumed in layers of the application, but disagreeing with application principles is rarely heretical.  As the principles are applied, they bring freedom, fulfillment and deep intellectual inquiry.
I know that with the critiques that have been published on this site, I stand in total opposition, but please understand that I went from a failing high school student right through grad school in constant skepticism of every tenent taught by IBLP.
Now I have been married for more than 20 years, and have raised two children under these prinicples and have found nothing but success in every venture associated with the application of these principles.
My conclusion is that so many who have posted on this site have difficulty in logical processes.  I delight in helping others to find proper expression of applying the principles of IBLP and tailoring them to the needs of anyone!  Please understand that I stated at the outset of this post that I don't agree 100% with anyone, but I agree more with Bill than I do with any other systematic application of practical scriptural interpretation I've ever encountered.
If anyone feels deceived by Bill, it is because Bill understands and interprets under a particular framework of understanding, and those who dissent, clearly have a problem considering more than one framework.  Bill would never knowingly twist interpretations, understandings, nor definitions simply to suit his presuppositions, but simply applies philosophical principles of understanding to in a later Wittgenstenian fashion.  Personally, I feel that Bill is right, righteous, and filled with wisdom, goodness, and light.  Logically, his teachings are efficient, productive and very helpful when taken in proper context and light.  They were never meant to be a dictum, but rather a direction or path that one might follow.  As I have followed the path more closely, I have found pure delight and success.  As I have strayed from the path, I have found difficulty, failure and agony.
I must also state that I have refrained from the Advanced seminar, and have felt his personal applications with ATI lead to isolationism, and I am evangelical.  So I have never chosen that path.  But I have seen brilliant men and women become more successful and more productive after applying IBLP to their lives, and have NEVER met anyone who fits any of these posts on this site.
I would enjoy a good open minded discussion with anyone regarding these thoughts whether in agreement or disagreement with my understanding.
DAVEIXOYE

[ninth doctor]

Perhaps someday I will be as enlightened an educated as you.How comforting to know that you have arrived to help us poor illogical dissenters see the truth.What a joy to know that all the crap we have endured was always our fault after all.Some people like to toot their horns but you sound like an entire marching band.

[Eliyahu Jones]

This is for dave9:

This a simple test to see whether we were all wrong about the gothard gestalt.  If, 15 to 20 yeas down the road, you still have a functional relationship with your children and he/she/they are educated and well equipped to provide meaningful and productive life, then congradulations!  You win..er...what every single ATI family thought the grand prize would be for their efforts.  The fact is that a clear majority of the families did not turn out so successfully.  What is the rate of second generation ATI folk?  Right now, my parents are 0 for 4 with five still in the house.  And I think that my 11 year old sister may turn out to be a lesbian, which is going to be a massively traumatic experience for her growing up in that household.  The people on these boards did not pull their respective life stories out of their respective asses.  As good as the character building sounds in theory, there is something genuinely heinous and dare I say, devilistic in the day to day opperations of the institutions...

[Jason24]

Gothard tends to twist terminology in the Bible and has his own definitions of words and phrases. This is what causes the most damage and makes the God of grace who wants to be our friend and savior out to be our task master and prison keeper.

Some of the words and phrases that he may have different defintions for are: grace, sanctification, justification, walking in the Spirit, dying to self, humility, and redemption.

These are just a few of the words, phrases and concepts that he may have different definitions for. If these essential truths are distorted we get a totally warped view of the gospel and our salvation is nullified and reduced to practically nothing. We then run on system of merit and works.

This thread is to expose and clearify some of lies and false definitions that cause many of us that have been influenced by Gothard's teachings to get a wrong view of God.

Grace: What does it mean? Is it unmerited favor? Is it the power to try harder to keep the law? Is it a ticket to heaven, but somehow we need to struggle and strive to somehow try to free ourselves from the evils of this world? Is it a license to keep on sinning and still get to heaven? What is it?

Walking in the Spirit: What is it? Is it trying hard to keep the law? Trusting in God's supernatural presence to live a transformed life? Is it mystical? Is it fantasy? Is it a frame of mind? Is it just positive thinking?

Justification: Is it JUST AS IF WE NEVER SINNED? Is it total pardon of sin: past, present and future? Is it only our past sins that are covered? Does it mean we are pleasing to God on the sole basis of the shed blood of Christ, or do we need to do something else? Does it mean we are postionally pardoned, but in reality we are still slaves to sin?

Sanctification: Does it mean we have to totally seperate ourselves from the world to be righteous? Is it a requirement for all who profess to know Christ? Is it a process or miracle from heaven or both? Is it something we do or something God does or both? Does it come automatically when we get saved or is it something that is continually worked out in our daily lives?

Dying to self: Is this total self abasement? Is this totally giving up the pleasures of this world? Is it just a position we have in Christ? Is it something that has already been accomplished when Jesus died on the cross or is this something that we have to struggle and strive to do in our daily lives?

Humility: What is it? Is it the state of being totally passive and submissive to the point where you become a door mat for everyone to walk on? Is it abondoning your free will and rights? Is simple trust in God? Is it relying upon God's power and strength and giving Him the glory for all things? Is it just not boasting in yourself? Is it total selflessness?

Redemption: What is it? Is being bought by the blood of Christ from the dominion of darkness? Does it mean Christ now has ownership of us so we don't have freedom? Does it mean we are free or are we still slaves? Are we slaves of Christ? Is it burdensome?

How one defines these terms greatly effects their relationship with God and how they view life. It is the difference between bondage and liberty, life and death, peace and restlessness, joy and dispair.

There may be many more terms I have not mentioned. This thread is to discuss these terms. It may include terms like: faith, obedience, loyalty, wisdom, the fear of God. Many of these terms have Gothardized definitions that puts his own slant on the Bible. Things that mess up the brain and frustrate the soul. Any term or concept that is used can be discussed on this thread.

I really did not understand what you're trying to get at. The concepts presented flew right over my head. Advanced seminars? What is this, Scientology, or something? :?  P.S. If there are any Scientologists here, I mean no offense. Scientology is just commonly associated with complicated, unusual, teachings. !alien